3 of 6
3

The Story So Far Is Stability; But Why?
Posted: 11 August 2007 12:27 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 31 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 1.7 stars out of 5 in 3 vote(s)
 
Activist
Total Posts:  100
Joined  2006-11-19
flenser - 11 August 2007 12:12 PM

billhos

He gave substance to Conservatives with his reforms on welfare, crime, tax reduction, banning porn and transforming the city.

Ruodolph Giuliani opposed welfare reform. That puts him to the left of Bill Clinton and completely out of step with the GOP.

And he did not “ban born”, another urban legend. You might want to visit NYC sometime. Porn is alive and thriving there.

He probably is to the left of most Republicans but not by any means all

And this is from a supporter of his.

And if the Dems nominate Hillary and fate elects her, I wonder if she’ll still throw dishes and other items inside the WH that resulted in constant repairs while she was there the last time.  There weren’t many dishes to take when they left as she had broken so many in rages against Bill.  Her vocabulary is also in the gutter.  The Secret Service knows.

As for Rudy, he’s managed in tough situations and all the others bring are flawed ambitions.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 12:28 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 32 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 3.8 stars out of 5 in 4 vote(s)
 
Leader
Total Posts:  281
Joined  2006-11-11
flenser - 11 August 2007 12:06 PM

Giuliani parts company with an important bloc of his party on an issue of critical importance to it.

Actually, Giuliani parts company with several important blocs of his party on issues of critical importance. For some reason the only one given any attention is abortion. I wonder what how the GOP base will react when they discover that he is pro-gay, pro gun-control, and pro amnesty for illegals?

Luckily for him (unluckily for the GOP), few people in the right wing media are highlighting these problems at present. But it’s hard to see how that ignorance can survive a Presidential run.

Exactly. That’s why party registration keeps going down. Very depressing to watch a Democrat take control of the GOP

 Signature 

Pasadena Phil (thewayweare.townhall.com)

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 12:42 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 33 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 5 stars out of 5 in 1 vote(s)
 
Voter
Total Posts:  7
Joined  2007-08-11

Jon S - you say that Hillary Clinton is only stating her position to achieve centrist atmospherics.  Actually, if you go back and look at her actions, not her recent primary election-focused rhetoric (designed to win Dem primaries, in a process where ALL Dem candidates veer left), she was vigorous in her support of the war to take out Saddam Hussein.  Her criticisms of GWB have mainly focused on his competence in running the occupation.  She still - alone of her major competitors - refuses to renounce her vote in favor of the invasion.  She still - alone of her major competitors (Biden is hopelessly behind) - refuses to pledge to remove all US troops from Iraq.  Personally, I believe that given her desire to overcome the assumption that a woman President would be a weak leader or a pacifist, Hillary Clinton will compensate by being much more aggressive as a Commander in Chief and maker of foreign policy than her hubby ever thought to be.  And she knows that the Dems will forgive her of her sins if she wins election and then reelection and satisfies their liberal wish lists on virtually every other policy topic.

So again, I submit that Hillary Clinton is actively opposing her base on their most cherished issue of the day in order to be elected to the Presidency, and not just nominated by a loser Dem party.

Giuliani does not actively oppose his base on any issue on which he has any ACTUAL control.  And on all the rest of the key Republican base issues - strong defense, activist foreign policy, cutting taxes, cutting government, cutting the influence of special interest groups, appointing conservative jurists, and indeed, ACTUALLY REDUCING ABORTIONS, while generally serving as an effective party General in the Republican war on Democrat political shenanigans, Rudy is dead on center with the base.  Rudy is almost 100% with the base on issues in which he as President can make an actual difference.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 12:52 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 34 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 4.7 stars out of 5 in 3 vote(s)
 
Voter
Total Posts:  1
Joined  2007-08-11

As a prolife evangelical in the great state of New Hampshire (which makes me part of a very small minority), my enthusiasm for Rudy is that he is devoted to small & effective government, demonstrated proven leadership, and has the best chance to defeat Hillary in 08.

While I wish he were pro-life, I’m satisfied that he 9s honest with his position (unlike Romney), be committed to strict constitutional judge appointments, and choose a strong pro-life running mate. 

I think Those of you who think Hillary will easily defeat him are not honestly assessing the strength of Rudy’s general election appeal.  He will draw massive numbers of independents, put into play otherwise Democratic states (NY, California, PA)…

And I really don’t think many pro-life conservatives would stay away from the polls.  And though they might have to hold their nose to pull the lever for Rudy, I think most of them honestly know that he would be a far better choice than Hillary. 

Should Rudy get the nomination and pick a Huckabee type running mate, I’m very confident the Rep will have the whitehouse for another 8 years.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 12:54 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 35 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 3.7 stars out of 5 in 3 vote(s)
 
Leader
Total Posts:  281
Joined  2006-11-11

Giuliani does not actively oppose his base on any issue on which he has any ACTUAL control.  And on all the rest of the key Republican base issues - strong defense, activist foreign policy, cutting taxes, cutting government, cutting the influence of special interest groups, appointing conservative jurists, and indeed, ACTUALLY REDUCING ABORTIONS, while generally serving as an effective party General in the Republican war on Democrat political shenanigans, Rudy is dead on center with the base.  Rudy is almost 100% with the base on issues in which he as President can make an actual difference.

Open borders is not consistent with being serious on national security. It also cancels your argument about cutting the influence of special interest groups and ACTUAL control. BJ Clinton coined to phrase “safe but rare” on abortion so Rudy’s position, which diametrically at odds with his own personal ethics, does not inspire confidence in his personal integrity. Rudy is a Democrat in the tradition of Hubert Humphrey. I respect him but he is a Democrat. We, on the other hand, are trying to nominate a Republican. Hillary’s platform is a clone of Rudy’s and all you are arguing is that we can’t trust her but we can trust Rudy. Hillary = Rudy and that will become more and more clear as the campaign moves on and the GOP will find that, like Tony Blankley stated months ago, they have dug a hole too deep for themselves. Americans always vote for the Democrat when forced to choose between a Democrat or a democrat. It will be no different this time. Especially when it becomes clear that neither candidate has coattails to prevent Congress from becomming more conservative. Split government works.

 Signature 

Pasadena Phil (thewayweare.townhall.com)

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 01:08 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 36 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 5 stars out of 5 in 2 vote(s)
 
D. Miller
Total Posts:  1899
Joined  2006-12-01

cpcharlie Posted: 11 August 2007 09:01 AM

Rudy is not a mainstream Republican because he does not appeal to the base which is conservative. That’s why he will not be elected president. There are only two possible results for Rudy at this point. Win the the Republican nomination and lose the race to Hillary. Or, lose the Republican nomination now and campaign to be appointed attorney general in the Fred Thompson administration. ...

Fred and Rudy’s temperaments accepting, Rudy would be a good VP,
Dick Cheney has set a new standard for a strong VP and if Rudy’s temperament would enjoy the number two spot, he could fill the spot superb.  These would help secure the northeast and give California a run for the money.

 Signature 

|| McCain `08 Palin ||

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 01:10 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 37 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 5 stars out of 5 in 1 vote(s)
 
Voter
Total Posts:  7
Joined  2007-08-11

Pasadena Phil - you couldn’t be more wrong than you are when you say the Giuliani is a Democrat or RINO.

Giuliani is the Dem’s worst nightmare - a Republican who attracts Republicans (should he win the nomination), a majority of independents, and at least some Dems.  Rudy opposes Dem policies on every topic, even abortion, and more than any other Republican candidate so far, he goes for the jugular against all of the Dem candidates and Dem Congressional leaders.

The Dem position on abortion is to have no restrictions whatsoever ... they chafe even at the restrictions imposed by Roe v. Wade.  They glory in abortions.  Giuliani states that he supports a woman’s right to make a very personal decision, but he also actively supports government policies that actually reduce abortions.  He also clearly supports the most conservative of our Supreme Court Justices, including Scalia, Thomas, Alito, and Roberts, and he would seek to appoint more Justices just like them.

Please, Phil - name a Dem candidate whose position matches THAT.

When people say that Rudy Giuliani is a RINO they are clearly revealing their own willful ignorance, or else they are revealing that they are so far in the tank on the single issue of criminalizing abortion - a position that will never be the law of the land in the USA - as to make themselves look utterly foolish.  Only a small proportion of Republicans are single issue anti-abortion fanatics.  Consistent results in opinion polling over many years shows that a large majority of Republicans are Republicans on a wide range of issues, and rank abortion policy far down the list of most critical issues facing our nation today.  Almost all recent polling of Republicans shows abortion policy ranking no better than fifth place, falling far below the concern expressed over national defense, taxation, government intrusion into private affairs, and the state of the economy.

And then for you to blame a drop in Republican registrations on a guy who is only one of the 8 or 9 candidates for the 2008 nomination is a ridiculous statement on its face.  After all, the drop in Republican registration occurred long before Giuliani even announced he was a candidate ... we lost the 2006 elections, by the way, in case you forgot.  There are multiple reasons why Republican registration has dropped since 2004 - i.e., people like to associate with winners (we lost in ‘06); dissatisfaction with the Iraq war; dissatisfaction with governmental competence (Katrina, etc.); dissatisfaction with immigration policy; Congressional corruption and lack of spending discipline; you name it.

Giuliani’s impact on Republican registration - whatever it might be - will only be evident if he wins the nomination, and then only after the votes are in from the 2008 general election.  Given that Giuliani consistently receives the highest positive ratings and lowest negative ratings in polls of all the candidates of both parties, it is very likely that Rudy has at least the potential to ramp up Republican party registration and voting at the polls in ‘08.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 01:37 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 38 ]  
Voter
Total Posts:  7
Joined  2007-08-11

Phil, Phil, Phil ... jousting with you is like playing Whack-a-Mole ... we’ve jousted before on HughHewitt.com.

Rudy Giuliani is not an “open borders” guy.  Period.  Never has been, isn’t now, won’t be in the future.

Giuliani did NOT support the recent Senate comprehensive immigration bill.  He attacked the McCain Kennedy bill.  He said he could not support a bill that did not effectively control the border or allow America to control who gets in and who doesn’t. 

Rudy is a law enforcement guy, for gosh sake.  That’s where he came from ... he was Reagan’s No. 3 guy at Justice in the early 1980s, where he served under Ed Meese and side by side with Ted Olsen and Chief Justice John Roberts ... from there, he became the Reagan-appointed US Attorney for the New York metro area, where he built a strong and famous record of aggressive law enforcement, including his virtual destruction of the NY Mafia and he took down major white collar criminals in the financial district.  From there Rudy became NYC Mayor, where for the first time in a generation he actually insisted that the State and municipal laws be enforced.  For which he caught hell from Dems and the special interest groups.

Rudy was not, however, responsible as Mayor for enforcement of Federal laws including immigration law, so don’t come back and say that he shoulda been a one man wrecking crew on illegal immigrants - by our Constitition, that responsibility is strictly a Federal issue, not one for local government.  In fact, Mayor Giuliani tried repeatedly to get the Feds (under Clinton) to deport the thousands of illegals he had locked up in his NYC jails, and the Feds declined to do so.

Today, Rudy Giuliani is a strong proponent of strict and effective border enforcement, as he has been a lifelong proponent of strong law enforcement in every other role he has ever played in our government.  Rudy does not favor or accept “amnesty”.  He doesn’t even want to discuss regularization unless and until the border is secured.  Rudy focuses his immigration policy strictly on controlling the border.  What is there for you to attack on that?  How does that not fit the Republican mainstream?  You are confusing and conflating Giuliani with McCain.

I suppose that the only criticism you can truthfully make of Giuliani on immigration, and have it stick, is that he is not Tom Tancredo (thank God!).  If Tancredo is your idea of Republican mainstream then you better go tell the rest of the Republicans to smarten up, because Tancredo isn’t even registering in the polls these days.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 01:57 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 39 ]  
Strategist
Total Posts:  104
Joined  2006-11-07

Athingortwo:  I agree with you completely on Rudy, but again, not on Hillary. I don’t buy the line that b/c she’ll be the first woman prez she’ll have to show her toughness, but on this only time will tell if she’s elected!  Her votes, her past positions and current rhetoric, the advisers she’s surrounded herself with, all tell me that her vote for war in Iraq was simply a vote to showcase her viability.  Period.  I don’t believe that she ever really supported the war; her passion speaking out against the surge is far more telling, in my book.

I do agree that one can be a critic of the way the war has been mishandled—I count myself as one of those critics, but not for the usual reasons the left musters—but I think with Hillary we’re seeing a candidate who needed a few ‘centrist’ votes (the Iraq war and the AUMF after 9/11, the latter of which practically all serious Dems voted for) but whose real beliefs are pre-9/11 through and through (like Kerry’s, and like virtually all major Dems today other than Lieberman).

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 02:04 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 40 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 3 stars out of 5 in 2 vote(s)
 
Leader
Total Posts:  281
Joined  2006-11-11

athingortwo - 11 August 2007 01:10 PM
Pasadena Phil - you couldn’t be more wrong than you are when you say the Giuliani is a Democrat or RINO.

Giuliani is the Dem’s worst nightmare- a Republican who attracts Republicans

Wrong. He’s a Democrat running as a Republican who attracts the same Democrats Hillary is trying desperately to hold onto while Obama and Edwards carry the torch for Moveon, the MSM and rest of the vocal and monied but unpopular socialist establishment.

The Dem position on abortion is to have no restrictions whatsoever ... they chafe even at the restrictions imposed by Roe v. Wade.

Completely unrestriced abortion rights is also Rudy’s personal position. Why would you trust a guy who promises to violate his own personal beliefs? He has always ACTED pro-abortion. Believe what you want to believe but the logic doesn’t flow and neither should credibility. I am not an abortion absolutist but I believe 45 million abortions since Roe v. Wade is criminal. Rudy has never been on our side on this issue.

Please, Phil - name a Dem candidate whose position matches THAT.

My point for a long time has been that Rudy should run as a Democrat because he IS that Democrat you want me to name. He would be saving the Democratic Party and the two-party system were he to do so. There hasn’t been a patriotic Democratic candidate since Hubert Humphrey and that is the appeal of Rudy among you “Anyone but Hillary!” absolutists.

When people say that Rudy Giuliani is a RINO they are clearly revealing their own willful ignorance, or else they are revealing that they are so far in the tank on the single issue of criminalizing abortion - a position that will never be the law of the land in the USA - as to make themselves look utterly foolish. 

That statement displays you live in your own echo chamber and are simply not listening to what people like me are saying. What we conservatives believe in has not changed. We feel very strongly about a very specific list of issues. You can argue each one as a “single issue” but that is just a false argument. It is the GOP that has changed by arguing that in order to beat a socialistic Democratic Party that keeps losing is for the GOP to become more like them - the big tent of nothingness - “we believe in everything” - no hangups.

And then for you to blame a drop in Republican registrations on a guy who is only one of the 8 or 9 candidates for the 2008 nomination is a ridiculous statement on its face. 

In other words, you don’t have an intelligent explanation other than I am an idiot. Declining party registrations is the singular definitive factor demonstrating voter dissatisfaction. Right now, voters don’t like either party nor their candidates.

After all, the drop in Republican registration occurred long before Giuliani even announced he was a candidate ... we lost the 2006 elections, by the way, in case you forgot.

Party registration erosion is continuing and in case you forgot, open-borders/amnesty was the killer last November and having an open-borders lobbyist and former mayor who pioneered the sanctuary city movement on the ticket is not going to make us national security conservatives flock to re-register GOP.

Given that Giuliani consistently receives the highest positive ratings and lowest negative ratings in polls of all the candidates of both parties, it is very likely that Rudy has at least the potential to ramp up Republican party registration and voting at the polls in ‘08.

As polls focus on party-registered voters to define “electability” while the ranks of disaffected independents continue to swell, you are simply engaging in self-delusion. Rudy may someday have 100% of the 15% of voters registered as Republicans but it would be better if we nominated someone with 52% of the 35% registered as Republicans.

Both parties are going to field hybrid candidates pretending to be largely what they are not. The same people who are predicting a Rudy victory are the same people who were already celebrating the passage of the amnesty bill. So much for these “experts”. The 32% of voters who identify themselves as conservatives outnumber either party and we feel very strongly about a very specific list of “single issues”. If you are going to be intellectually honest, you are really going to have to end your twisted logic. You aren’t fooling anyone but yourself. I can see I am not rating any stars with this pro-Rudy string but we conservatives are winning and gaining momentum. The GOP could wake up and join us but seems determined to pander to the global interest money and extend its 2006 losses. I am willing to suffer two years of a very weak Hillary or Rudy presidency (with 35% of the vote) until the 2010 election when we can elect an even more conservative Congress than we will elect in 2008.

 Signature 

Pasadena Phil (thewayweare.townhall.com)

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 02:16 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 41 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 5 stars out of 5 in 1 vote(s)
 
Leader
Total Posts:  281
Joined  2006-11-11

athingortwo - 11 August 2007 01:37 PM
Phil, Phil, Phil ... jousting with you is like playing Whack-a-Mole ... we’ve jousted before on HughHewitt.com.

Rudy Giuliani is not an “open borders” guy.  Period.  Never has been, isn’t now, won’t be in the future.

Google “Bracewell and Guiliani” (lobbyist for open borders issues on behalf of the Mexican government and global corporate interests) and then research “sanctuary cities”. Whack-a-mole? You are just plain WRONG!!! Wake up already!!

If you feel so strong about SPECIFIC Republican issues, why don’t you abandon a Democrat who has lived and governed on the wrong side of almost every single issue. Politicians are all pandering weasels. I don’t trust Rudy to keep promises that violate everything he believes in any more than I trust Hillary to not be a socialist. Don’t be so naive. (Name calling sure advances a discussion doesn’t it?)

 Signature 

Pasadena Phil (thewayweare.townhall.com)

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 02:55 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 42 ]  
K. Rove
Total Posts:  305
Joined  2007-07-14

I agree with athingortwo:

Guiliani has answered very well many of the concerns of the majority of the “Republican” (which is a misnomer) concerns of a candidate. There were things which he could have answered better, yes.

If you look at his actions, and the strategies which he used to improve the conditions of New York City, you can easily see a primarily conservative ideology there.

What did he do?

He cut taxes. His reasoning? That lower taxes would actually have the end result of increasing his budget. That lower taxes would promote investment into small businesses in New York.

Is that a Conservative or a “progressive” point of view? I would say it was Conservative.

He rigorously promoted law enforcement for all of the “little” laws; laws typically ignored by Cities with budget constraints. His reasoning?
He believed that the same people who ignore the “less important laws” are--or will become--the same people which are breaking ALL of the laws and that non-enforcement encourages lawless behavior.

Again, is that a Conservative or Progressive social theory?
The answer is: Conservative--Goldwater Conservative. It may not be a “Republican” thing, but it is a very conservative idea that every law should be enforceable and enforced, or taken off the books. “Any law which is ignored diminishes all of the rest of them, including the Constitution of These United States” is major tenet of Conservative thought; which is why “Republicanism” and “Conservatism” are two different things.

Well, what about abortion? Is the subject covered by existing Laws and Ordinances? Oh, it is? You mean he inherited them? Conservatives don’t blow off existing laws, they may seek to change them--but they do so within the constraints of the Laws themselves. Is that so hard to understand?

Is it a fact that Giulianni promoted adoption as an alternative to abortion? Yes or No? The answer was yes.

Did he encourage alternatives to abortion to be included in all funded prenatal counseling? Yes or No? The answer is yes.

Did he promote or encourage the inclusion of abstinence and alternatives to abortion in sex-education in the City schools? Yes or No? My GUESS is Yes. This one particular I don’t remember reading anywhere--you may have me on that one.

Roe vs. Wade and of itself is simply bad law to begin with.  It was a red-herring and continues to be.  It was a manipulation of an emotional subject to use as a means to subvert the Constitution.  If a woman has a vitamin deficiency and has a spontaneous miscarriage--is she a criminal?  What if her deficiency is of genetic origin?  What are the actual repurcussions of Roe v Wade; as it has been applied to the Law?  Are these “collateral issues” the real purpose for hearing the case?  Were the opinions of the Court a precise explanation of the issues involved, and how the case was to be interpreted and applied by the courts to other cases?
What effect has the law had upon the sovereignty of local Government?  State Government?  Think dammit!

The subject of Immigration Law: Inherited, but I don’t know of anything which he did to influence things in a more Conservative direction. This one is completely open to debate--I don’t see any clear indication of a conservative “bent” on this subject at all. Was this something which was ignored?

There are limits to activism. One could easily argue that strident activism would have resulted in absolutely nothing being accomplished during his tenure as Mayor of New York.

How about Gun Laws? OUCH! You definitely have me on that one--or do you? It’s about half-and-half.

From his personal commentary about issues, it can be inferred very easily that he believes that the obligations and authority of State and Local Governments, and those of the Federal Government should be clearly defined and enforced. Gun Laws, Gay Marriage, and Abortion are subjects which he has clearly stated should be handled by the States, not the Federal Government. That would be a Republican position--not a conservative one.
The Classic Conservative position on the issue of Gun Control was defined prior to the Civil War: It is an issue which is to be defined by Local Law and Ordinance. It was not unusual to have to check with the local sheriff about the local gun ordinances when entering a town in the “territories”. Many towns forbid unsecured firearms and that was acceptable to the courts at the time. The right of ownership was covered by the 2nd amendment, but the specifics as to what you can do with them were covered by local ordinance.

The “Republican” viewpoint on Gun ownership does not appear to be well thought out. Appearances indicate it is a mindless pursuit of votes.

Gay Marriage:
The Conservative view (as the result of an informal poll,) is that the word “Marriage” is of religious origin and should not be extended to include those things which are anti-thetical to religious doctrineThat would constitute a governmental imposition of RELIGIOUS law; in essence, it would be the imposition of a “State Religion”.  ”Civil Union” on the other hand, supports, encourages and rewards stable relationships. This, in theory, encourages civility and social responsibility; part of the bedrock of Civilisation.  The “Republican” view?  Don’t really know.

Abortion:  Covered above.

All in all, I’d say he is acceptable to many, if not most conservatives (were they to educate themselves.)
EDIT: emphasis

 Signature 

Statistics are a means to write fiction--scientifically.
“The worst offense that can be committed by a polemic is to stigmatize those who hold a contrary opinion as bad and immoral men.” [John Stuart Mill, 1806-73]

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 03:08 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 43 ]

This post's average rating is:

  • 5 stars out of 5 in 1 vote(s)
 
Activist
Total Posts:  92
Joined  2007-06-16

Hey Snowman,

There are lots of conservatives who agree that it is still too early to campaign. Wait till Thanksgiving and don’t prematurely pop your cork. The landscape will change after Labor Day anyway.

Until then, relax, enjoy life. Don’t have meltdown. Glad your son is serving.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 03:28 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 44 ]  
W. Churchill
Total Posts:  3886
Joined  2006-11-07
athingortwo - 11 August 2007 01:37 PM

Rudy Giuliani is not an “open borders” guy.  Period.  Never has been, isn’t now, won’t be in the future.

Giuliani did NOT support the recent Senate comprehensive immigration bill.  He attacked the McCain Kennedy bill.  He said he could not support a bill that did not effectively control the border or allow America to control who gets in and who doesn’t....
Today, Rudy Giuliani is a strong proponent of strict and effective border enforcement, as he has been a lifelong proponent of strong law enforcement in every other role he has ever played in our government.  Rudy does not favor or accept “amnesty”.

I don’t know where you got your information, but I heard Rudy tell Sean Hannity that we have to deal with the 12-20 million already here “realistically.” I heard that word enough in the recent debate in Congress to know what that means: blanket amnesty and all that goes with it:

Rudy established the #1 sanctuary city in America.
Rudy enabled illegal aliens in NYC to access social services that are paid for by American taxpayers.
Rudy refused to turn them over to federal authorities for deportation.
Rudy refused to allow police to inquire about legal residency.
Rudy supports illegal aliens accessing our health care and education systems.
Rudy thinks that illegal aliens are necessary for our economy.
Rudy believes that they do the work Americans won’t do.

Border security is only part of the solution, and I don’t agree with Giuliani’s ideas on how to deal with the rest of the problem.

 
 
Posted: 11 August 2007 03:40 PM   [ Ignore ]  [ # 45 ]  
W. Churchill
Total Posts:  4175
Joined  2007-07-11
StuLongIsland - 11 August 2007 12:26 PM

The Abortion Issue or who is more Conservative will not matter if a pro defense candidate is not elected. Imagine Hillary or Obamma in office, they probably select Wesley Clark to be Secretary of Defense, etc. If that’s the case many of us will be aborted by the enemies of our civilization.

I am not in favor of this pairing, however its who I suspect will be President and Vice President, for 8 long more years.

hillary clinton and ombamma, in that order, because hrc will not allow anyone else to be top dog.
I do not want to see that happen, at the momnent the repubs are twisting in the wind. McCain? barf.,
I would vote for Duncan Hunter, tancredo not becuase I think they are the brightest of the bright, I like their positon on illegals invading the usa.

 Signature 

The
pacifists
always lose, because the anti-pacifists kill them

 
 
3 of 6
3

You need to be logged in to reply. Please Login or Register