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A College Degree Might be Worth Nothing: Many college graduates wind up doing jobs that don’t require higher education.by George Leef

The Bureau of Labor Statistics compiles data on occupations and the educational credentials of the workers in them. If you access the BLS site you find a host of interesting information. For instance, 45 percent of insurance sales agents have a BA degree, compared with 36 percent who have “some college” and 18 percent with a high school education. Among fitness and aerobics trainers, 47 percent have a BA, compared with 32 percent who have “some college” and 21 percent with a high school education. We find that only 25 percent of retail sales supervisors, 31 percent of airline flight attendants, 22 percent of customer service representatives, 26 percent of travel agents, and 11 percent of correctional officers have a BA.

That’s just a small sample.

The BLS statistics confirm that large numbers of Americans with college degrees are not earning big bucks in jobs that demand years of academic preparation. They’re often doing work that can be and is done by others who have not spent years of their lives and accumulated considerable debts in obtaining college degrees.

None of this is meant to say that it’s a bad thing to have college educated claims adjusters, floral designers, purchasing agents, and massage therapists. They may have enjoyed learning about history, philosophy, literature and so forth – or whatever courses they took – and may be better people for it. But let’s not proclaim that taking the courses needed for a degree will lead to financial gain for everyone. For many it’s a huge debt trap.

Source:  http://tinyurl.com/5zxo6r

None of this is meant to say that it’s a bad thing to have college educated claims adjusters, floral designers, purchasing agents, and massage therapists. They may have enjoyed learning about history, philosophy, literature and so forth – or whatever courses they took – and may be better people for it. But let’s not proclaim that taking the courses needed for a degree will lead to financial gain for everyone.

That may be true (said the ex-music major) but there are many, many studies showing that college graduates make, on average, far more money than non-graduates, and can expect to make, over the course of their lifetimes, many times more than they spent on the college education. In other words, it has a great return on investment.

Did you read the beginning of the article, Vlad?  Apparently that’s not true anymore.  Here is the relevant text:

So it is newsworthy when someone in the education establishment challenges the idea that there is a huge payoff to getting a college degree. That’s what happened earlier this month when Charles Miller, who served as the Chairman of Education Secretary Margaret Spellings’ Commission on the Future of Higher Education wrote to the president of The College Board, complaining that its widely circulated annual report “Education Pays” greatly exaggerates the financial benefit that a student can expect from college.

In his letter to College Board president Gaston Caperton, Miller said, “The lifetime earnings differential has had such an important place in higher education in justifying the costs of receiving a college degree that any conclusion derived from it must absolutely stand on sound assumptions.” He then proceeded to question the assumptions and arguing that as an investment, college might have a negative return for some students.

He’s absolutely right. Public officials should stop tossing around big numbers – or any numbers at all – as the payoff from going to college. There’s no guarantee that a degree will necessarily have any financial benefit. Going to college guarantees a lot of expenses, but does not guarantee compensating rewards.

I did read it, but after all that buildup, it boils down to -

He then proceeded to question the assumptions and arguing that as an investment, college might have a negative return for some students.

Well, of course it “might.” I know a guy who went through college and med school and during his residency got strung out on drugs and now lives on the streets. That investment certainly didn’t pay off.

But there are zillions of studies showing that college graduates make, on average, much more than non-graduates. Anecdotes about philosophy majors who are now programmers doesn’t change that.

vladimir estragon - 01 May 2008 05:29 PM

I did read it, but after all that buildup, it boils down to -

He then proceeded to question the assumptions and arguing that as an investment, college might have a negative return for some students.

Well, of course it “might.” I know a guy who went through college and med school and during his residency got strung out on drugs and now lives on the streets. That investment certainly didn’t pay off.

But there are zillions of studies showing that college graduates make, on average, much more than non-graduates. Anecdotes about philosophy majors who are now programmers doesn’t change that.

Blinding lightning flash followed by deafening thunder clap

I think Vlad is right.

The article is not saying that a person will not make more money with a college degree than he or she would without one.  The article says that the situation is being hyped; so that every student believes that he or she will succeed with a college degree, when that is not true.

Clearly the article shows that in some jobs, you do not necessarily need a college degree to prosper.  The article also makes clear that getting a degree is a good thing.

Are you merely being contrary, Vlad?

Public officials should stop tossing around big numbers – or any numbers at all – as the payoff from going to college. There’s no guarantee that a degree will necessarily have any financial benefit. Going to college guarantees a lot of expenses, but does not guarantee compensating rewards.

Anybody who goes to college and thinks that they’re “guaranteed” a big income shouldn’t be going to college.

vladimir estragon - 01 May 2008 07:13 PM

Anybody who goes to college and thinks that they’re “guaranteed” a big income shouldn’t be going to college.

I don’t agree. It depends on the industry or trade. Until community colleges begin offering more comprehensive courses in law, one will have to attend a graduate law school if one hopes to catch on with a good or at least successful firm. Pre-med to residency, etc. I don’t agree, by the way, that college should be exclusively a glorified trade tech. There’s even that struggle today among some in the academy. But they are left with little else once they abandoned Catholicism and the very purpose for a university education in the ‘classics’. All they have left is doctor, lawyer, or ‘advertising’ chief.

To be clear. Engineers can experiment with some things on a grad school’s dime that they might not otherwise on their own. So, there is research. And there are even still scholars here and there, depending on department and individual calling.

And there is prestige and opportunity. If one sees MIT or Harvard as diploma mills, in a sense, then these particular diplomas may help a great deal in whether you or the other guy gets the promotion to the executive position, or finds their face on the prospectus, or is even allowed to make that pitch to the investors. Prestige may not count so much on the shop floor or the engineering office. But it may when courting the outside world. And would there be a Yahoo with a ‘renewed mission’ if Yang hadn’t been at Stanford, exposed to such notions, and able to bounce ideas off others? Same for many start-ups. It’s not just ‘contacts’ for later, but contacts that produce even at the time. Whatever the failures of the university, otherwise, would this have happened without?

Pongo is correct. There are many areas in the work force that do not require a college degree to get hired. I have older brothers that are 7 and 8 hears older than me. they do not have college degrees in the jobs they have. When I tried to get hired by the same company I was denied. The funny part of was that I did much better than my brothers did in high school.

I went off to college for 2 years and decided I didn’t want to major in Chemical Engineering. I left college and joined the military for 3 years in order to get money to pay for college and to decide on what degree to pursue afterward.

When I finally received my degree that wasn’t enough. Now they wanted a 4 year degree and work experience. Or, better yet, they wanted a masters degree.

The current job I work in has many people without degrees. The newer employees(less than 10 years) have more work experience and degrees now.

What Pongo is saying that it is harder to even get a job that doesn’t require a degree because there are more applicants that do have a degree. If I had a choice on hiring two equally experienced candidates. If one had a degree I would hire the one with a degree. This only makes sence. I don’t know what the numbers are but I have a feeling that as a percentage of the population more people are getting degrees than ever before.

The market is being flooded with people with college degrees. It doesn’t mean it needed people with degrees. It means that there are more people with degrees applying for jobs that really don’t need a degree to do the job.

In Minnesota, to become a police officer, a candidate needs a 2 year criminal justice degree and has to pass the skills test. These alone won’t get you the job in Minnesota. To be considered for full time law enforcement positin, one needs a 4 year degree, Skills and other law enforcement experience like: security, military experience in police work, youth police programs volunteering at halfway houses. Oh yeah, good grades help too.